What is the relationship between relativity and the Doppler effect?Relativistic Doppler Effect compared with...
How do I hide Chekhov's Gun?
Bach's Toccata and Fugue in D minor breaks the "no parallel octaves" rule?
Custom alignment for GeoMarkers
What did “the good wine” (τὸν καλὸν οἶνον) mean in John 2:10?
Non-trivial topology where only open sets are closed
Is it good practice to use Linear Least-Squares with SMA?
Why did it take so long to abandon sail after steamships were demonstrated?
Why is the President allowed to veto a cancellation of emergency powers?
ERC721: How to get the owned tokens of an address
Brexit - No Deal Rejection
Counting models satisfying a boolean formula
Employee lack of ownership
Book about superhumans hiding among normal humans
Why is a white electrical wire connected to 2 black wires?
What exactly is this small puffer fish doing and how did it manage to accomplish such a feat?
How to deal with taxi scam when on vacation?
How to write cleanly even if my character uses expletive language?
Welcoming 2019 Pi day: How to draw the letter π?
How do I change two letters closest to a string and one letter immediately after a string using Notepad++?
Recruiter wants very extensive technical details about all of my previous work
Bacteria contamination inside a thermos bottle
Have the tides ever turned twice on any open problem?
World War I as a war of liberals against authoritarians?
Simplify an interface for flexibly applying rules to periods of time
What is the relationship between relativity and the Doppler effect?
Relativistic Doppler Effect compared with Classical Doppler EffectThe Equivalence principle of General Relativity and the Doppler EffectDoppler effect via reflectionDoes Doppler Effect violate Galilean relativity?Spectral lines and the Doppler effectTransverse Doppler effect (classical)What is the difference between these formulas? (Doppler effect)Doppler Effect and RelativityWhat is this connection between clocks and the Doppler effect?Doppler Effect and Speed relativity
$begingroup$
My sister just watched this video about space contraction (Spanish), and asked me if this is related to doppler effect.
In the clip they also introduce the idea that a bat would be affected by similar effects when measuring an object's length, due to the time it takes for sound to propagate.
I told her that:
Doppler effect is about alteration of the perceived frequency of a
signal produced by the relative movement between transmitter and
receiver. The quoted video is about relativity, which is a "deeper" effect.
Maybe doppler effect can be understood as the effect of relativity on
a wave phenomena.
Now I'm wondering about her intuition. If she's right, should I be able to take a sin function, apply a Lorentz transform to it, and arrive to same results as with the doppler formula? Unfortunately, the maths are beyond my skills.
Can someone shed some light about the relation between doppler and relativity, if any? Can be doppler effect explained by relativity/Lorentz alone?
general-relativity doppler-effect popular-science
New contributor
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
My sister just watched this video about space contraction (Spanish), and asked me if this is related to doppler effect.
In the clip they also introduce the idea that a bat would be affected by similar effects when measuring an object's length, due to the time it takes for sound to propagate.
I told her that:
Doppler effect is about alteration of the perceived frequency of a
signal produced by the relative movement between transmitter and
receiver. The quoted video is about relativity, which is a "deeper" effect.
Maybe doppler effect can be understood as the effect of relativity on
a wave phenomena.
Now I'm wondering about her intuition. If she's right, should I be able to take a sin function, apply a Lorentz transform to it, and arrive to same results as with the doppler formula? Unfortunately, the maths are beyond my skills.
Can someone shed some light about the relation between doppler and relativity, if any? Can be doppler effect explained by relativity/Lorentz alone?
general-relativity doppler-effect popular-science
New contributor
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
My sister just watched this video about space contraction (Spanish), and asked me if this is related to doppler effect.
In the clip they also introduce the idea that a bat would be affected by similar effects when measuring an object's length, due to the time it takes for sound to propagate.
I told her that:
Doppler effect is about alteration of the perceived frequency of a
signal produced by the relative movement between transmitter and
receiver. The quoted video is about relativity, which is a "deeper" effect.
Maybe doppler effect can be understood as the effect of relativity on
a wave phenomena.
Now I'm wondering about her intuition. If she's right, should I be able to take a sin function, apply a Lorentz transform to it, and arrive to same results as with the doppler formula? Unfortunately, the maths are beyond my skills.
Can someone shed some light about the relation between doppler and relativity, if any? Can be doppler effect explained by relativity/Lorentz alone?
general-relativity doppler-effect popular-science
New contributor
$endgroup$
My sister just watched this video about space contraction (Spanish), and asked me if this is related to doppler effect.
In the clip they also introduce the idea that a bat would be affected by similar effects when measuring an object's length, due to the time it takes for sound to propagate.
I told her that:
Doppler effect is about alteration of the perceived frequency of a
signal produced by the relative movement between transmitter and
receiver. The quoted video is about relativity, which is a "deeper" effect.
Maybe doppler effect can be understood as the effect of relativity on
a wave phenomena.
Now I'm wondering about her intuition. If she's right, should I be able to take a sin function, apply a Lorentz transform to it, and arrive to same results as with the doppler formula? Unfortunately, the maths are beyond my skills.
Can someone shed some light about the relation between doppler and relativity, if any? Can be doppler effect explained by relativity/Lorentz alone?
general-relativity doppler-effect popular-science
general-relativity doppler-effect popular-science
New contributor
New contributor
edited 19 mins ago
knzhou
45k11122218
45k11122218
New contributor
asked 6 hours ago
jjmontesjjmontes
1164
1164
New contributor
New contributor
add a comment |
add a comment |
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
$begingroup$
The ordinary Doppler effect is independent of relativity; it's basically just a fact of kinematics. It's not even really a wave phenomenon; it also applies to particles. For example, the Doppler effect explains why your car windshield gets wetter faster when you're driving than when you're parked.
The formula for the Doppler effect is
$$f_o = frac{v - v_o}{v - v_s} f_s$$
where $f_o$ is the observed frequency, $f_s$ is the source's emitted frequency, and $v_0$ and $v_s$ are the velocities of the observer and source. These are absolute velocities; they have to be defined with respect to the medium, e.g. the air for a sound wave. Relativity adds a correction to this formula because both the source and the observer will experience time dilation, so we should really have
$$gamma_0 f_0 = frac{v - v_o}{v - v_s} gamma_s f_s.$$
This is a very small correction assuming the speeds are small.
When people talk about the relativistic Doppler effect, they usually mean the Doppler effect for light waves specifically, with full relativistic corrections. Light waves are exceptional because they have no medium, so we aren't tied to a specific frame. It's instead more convenient to go to the observer's frame, where we naively have
$$f_o = frac{c - v_r}{c} f_s$$
where $v_r$ is the relative velocity. Relativity corrects this formula in two ways. First, velocities don't quite add linearly, so $v_r neq v_o - v_s$ in general. Second, we have to remember the time dilation factor for the source,
$$f_o = frac{c - v_r}{c} gamma_s f_s = sqrt{frac{1 - v_r/c}{1 + v_r/c}} f_s.$$
There is no time dilation factor for the observer, because we're in the observer's frame, where they are at rest. This last formula is what people usually call "the relativistic Doppler effect", but again it's pretty close to the nonrelativistic result as long as $v_r ll c$.
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
There is a Doppler effect even without Special or General Relativity, just arising from Galilean relative motion. For example, neither of these theories is necessary to explain the fact that the pitch of an ambulance siren changes as it passes by.
However, relativity does have to be taken into account when calculating the Doppler effect for a fast-moving object or one in a strong gravitational field. In other words, there are relativistic corrections to the Doppler effect.
If you use a Lorentz transformation to derive the Doppler effect, you will get the right answer for any velocity, but you won’t get the Doppler effect for a gravitational field.
$endgroup$
add a comment |
Your Answer
StackExchange.ifUsing("editor", function () {
return StackExchange.using("mathjaxEditing", function () {
StackExchange.MarkdownEditor.creationCallbacks.add(function (editor, postfix) {
StackExchange.mathjaxEditing.prepareWmdForMathJax(editor, postfix, [["$", "$"], ["\\(","\\)"]]);
});
});
}, "mathjax-editing");
StackExchange.ready(function() {
var channelOptions = {
tags: "".split(" "),
id: "151"
};
initTagRenderer("".split(" "), "".split(" "), channelOptions);
StackExchange.using("externalEditor", function() {
// Have to fire editor after snippets, if snippets enabled
if (StackExchange.settings.snippets.snippetsEnabled) {
StackExchange.using("snippets", function() {
createEditor();
});
}
else {
createEditor();
}
});
function createEditor() {
StackExchange.prepareEditor({
heartbeatType: 'answer',
autoActivateHeartbeat: false,
convertImagesToLinks: false,
noModals: true,
showLowRepImageUploadWarning: true,
reputationToPostImages: null,
bindNavPrevention: true,
postfix: "",
imageUploader: {
brandingHtml: "Powered by u003ca class="icon-imgur-white" href="https://imgur.com/"u003eu003c/au003e",
contentPolicyHtml: "User contributions licensed under u003ca href="https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0/"u003ecc by-sa 3.0 with attribution requiredu003c/au003e u003ca href="https://stackoverflow.com/legal/content-policy"u003e(content policy)u003c/au003e",
allowUrls: true
},
noCode: true, onDemand: true,
discardSelector: ".discard-answer"
,immediatelyShowMarkdownHelp:true
});
}
});
jjmontes is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function () {
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
});
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
StackExchange.ready(
function () {
StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2fphysics.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f466848%2fwhat-is-the-relationship-between-relativity-and-the-doppler-effect%23new-answer', 'question_page');
}
);
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
$begingroup$
The ordinary Doppler effect is independent of relativity; it's basically just a fact of kinematics. It's not even really a wave phenomenon; it also applies to particles. For example, the Doppler effect explains why your car windshield gets wetter faster when you're driving than when you're parked.
The formula for the Doppler effect is
$$f_o = frac{v - v_o}{v - v_s} f_s$$
where $f_o$ is the observed frequency, $f_s$ is the source's emitted frequency, and $v_0$ and $v_s$ are the velocities of the observer and source. These are absolute velocities; they have to be defined with respect to the medium, e.g. the air for a sound wave. Relativity adds a correction to this formula because both the source and the observer will experience time dilation, so we should really have
$$gamma_0 f_0 = frac{v - v_o}{v - v_s} gamma_s f_s.$$
This is a very small correction assuming the speeds are small.
When people talk about the relativistic Doppler effect, they usually mean the Doppler effect for light waves specifically, with full relativistic corrections. Light waves are exceptional because they have no medium, so we aren't tied to a specific frame. It's instead more convenient to go to the observer's frame, where we naively have
$$f_o = frac{c - v_r}{c} f_s$$
where $v_r$ is the relative velocity. Relativity corrects this formula in two ways. First, velocities don't quite add linearly, so $v_r neq v_o - v_s$ in general. Second, we have to remember the time dilation factor for the source,
$$f_o = frac{c - v_r}{c} gamma_s f_s = sqrt{frac{1 - v_r/c}{1 + v_r/c}} f_s.$$
There is no time dilation factor for the observer, because we're in the observer's frame, where they are at rest. This last formula is what people usually call "the relativistic Doppler effect", but again it's pretty close to the nonrelativistic result as long as $v_r ll c$.
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
The ordinary Doppler effect is independent of relativity; it's basically just a fact of kinematics. It's not even really a wave phenomenon; it also applies to particles. For example, the Doppler effect explains why your car windshield gets wetter faster when you're driving than when you're parked.
The formula for the Doppler effect is
$$f_o = frac{v - v_o}{v - v_s} f_s$$
where $f_o$ is the observed frequency, $f_s$ is the source's emitted frequency, and $v_0$ and $v_s$ are the velocities of the observer and source. These are absolute velocities; they have to be defined with respect to the medium, e.g. the air for a sound wave. Relativity adds a correction to this formula because both the source and the observer will experience time dilation, so we should really have
$$gamma_0 f_0 = frac{v - v_o}{v - v_s} gamma_s f_s.$$
This is a very small correction assuming the speeds are small.
When people talk about the relativistic Doppler effect, they usually mean the Doppler effect for light waves specifically, with full relativistic corrections. Light waves are exceptional because they have no medium, so we aren't tied to a specific frame. It's instead more convenient to go to the observer's frame, where we naively have
$$f_o = frac{c - v_r}{c} f_s$$
where $v_r$ is the relative velocity. Relativity corrects this formula in two ways. First, velocities don't quite add linearly, so $v_r neq v_o - v_s$ in general. Second, we have to remember the time dilation factor for the source,
$$f_o = frac{c - v_r}{c} gamma_s f_s = sqrt{frac{1 - v_r/c}{1 + v_r/c}} f_s.$$
There is no time dilation factor for the observer, because we're in the observer's frame, where they are at rest. This last formula is what people usually call "the relativistic Doppler effect", but again it's pretty close to the nonrelativistic result as long as $v_r ll c$.
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
The ordinary Doppler effect is independent of relativity; it's basically just a fact of kinematics. It's not even really a wave phenomenon; it also applies to particles. For example, the Doppler effect explains why your car windshield gets wetter faster when you're driving than when you're parked.
The formula for the Doppler effect is
$$f_o = frac{v - v_o}{v - v_s} f_s$$
where $f_o$ is the observed frequency, $f_s$ is the source's emitted frequency, and $v_0$ and $v_s$ are the velocities of the observer and source. These are absolute velocities; they have to be defined with respect to the medium, e.g. the air for a sound wave. Relativity adds a correction to this formula because both the source and the observer will experience time dilation, so we should really have
$$gamma_0 f_0 = frac{v - v_o}{v - v_s} gamma_s f_s.$$
This is a very small correction assuming the speeds are small.
When people talk about the relativistic Doppler effect, they usually mean the Doppler effect for light waves specifically, with full relativistic corrections. Light waves are exceptional because they have no medium, so we aren't tied to a specific frame. It's instead more convenient to go to the observer's frame, where we naively have
$$f_o = frac{c - v_r}{c} f_s$$
where $v_r$ is the relative velocity. Relativity corrects this formula in two ways. First, velocities don't quite add linearly, so $v_r neq v_o - v_s$ in general. Second, we have to remember the time dilation factor for the source,
$$f_o = frac{c - v_r}{c} gamma_s f_s = sqrt{frac{1 - v_r/c}{1 + v_r/c}} f_s.$$
There is no time dilation factor for the observer, because we're in the observer's frame, where they are at rest. This last formula is what people usually call "the relativistic Doppler effect", but again it's pretty close to the nonrelativistic result as long as $v_r ll c$.
$endgroup$
The ordinary Doppler effect is independent of relativity; it's basically just a fact of kinematics. It's not even really a wave phenomenon; it also applies to particles. For example, the Doppler effect explains why your car windshield gets wetter faster when you're driving than when you're parked.
The formula for the Doppler effect is
$$f_o = frac{v - v_o}{v - v_s} f_s$$
where $f_o$ is the observed frequency, $f_s$ is the source's emitted frequency, and $v_0$ and $v_s$ are the velocities of the observer and source. These are absolute velocities; they have to be defined with respect to the medium, e.g. the air for a sound wave. Relativity adds a correction to this formula because both the source and the observer will experience time dilation, so we should really have
$$gamma_0 f_0 = frac{v - v_o}{v - v_s} gamma_s f_s.$$
This is a very small correction assuming the speeds are small.
When people talk about the relativistic Doppler effect, they usually mean the Doppler effect for light waves specifically, with full relativistic corrections. Light waves are exceptional because they have no medium, so we aren't tied to a specific frame. It's instead more convenient to go to the observer's frame, where we naively have
$$f_o = frac{c - v_r}{c} f_s$$
where $v_r$ is the relative velocity. Relativity corrects this formula in two ways. First, velocities don't quite add linearly, so $v_r neq v_o - v_s$ in general. Second, we have to remember the time dilation factor for the source,
$$f_o = frac{c - v_r}{c} gamma_s f_s = sqrt{frac{1 - v_r/c}{1 + v_r/c}} f_s.$$
There is no time dilation factor for the observer, because we're in the observer's frame, where they are at rest. This last formula is what people usually call "the relativistic Doppler effect", but again it's pretty close to the nonrelativistic result as long as $v_r ll c$.
edited 5 hours ago
answered 6 hours ago
knzhouknzhou
45k11122218
45k11122218
add a comment |
add a comment |
$begingroup$
There is a Doppler effect even without Special or General Relativity, just arising from Galilean relative motion. For example, neither of these theories is necessary to explain the fact that the pitch of an ambulance siren changes as it passes by.
However, relativity does have to be taken into account when calculating the Doppler effect for a fast-moving object or one in a strong gravitational field. In other words, there are relativistic corrections to the Doppler effect.
If you use a Lorentz transformation to derive the Doppler effect, you will get the right answer for any velocity, but you won’t get the Doppler effect for a gravitational field.
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
There is a Doppler effect even without Special or General Relativity, just arising from Galilean relative motion. For example, neither of these theories is necessary to explain the fact that the pitch of an ambulance siren changes as it passes by.
However, relativity does have to be taken into account when calculating the Doppler effect for a fast-moving object or one in a strong gravitational field. In other words, there are relativistic corrections to the Doppler effect.
If you use a Lorentz transformation to derive the Doppler effect, you will get the right answer for any velocity, but you won’t get the Doppler effect for a gravitational field.
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
There is a Doppler effect even without Special or General Relativity, just arising from Galilean relative motion. For example, neither of these theories is necessary to explain the fact that the pitch of an ambulance siren changes as it passes by.
However, relativity does have to be taken into account when calculating the Doppler effect for a fast-moving object or one in a strong gravitational field. In other words, there are relativistic corrections to the Doppler effect.
If you use a Lorentz transformation to derive the Doppler effect, you will get the right answer for any velocity, but you won’t get the Doppler effect for a gravitational field.
$endgroup$
There is a Doppler effect even without Special or General Relativity, just arising from Galilean relative motion. For example, neither of these theories is necessary to explain the fact that the pitch of an ambulance siren changes as it passes by.
However, relativity does have to be taken into account when calculating the Doppler effect for a fast-moving object or one in a strong gravitational field. In other words, there are relativistic corrections to the Doppler effect.
If you use a Lorentz transformation to derive the Doppler effect, you will get the right answer for any velocity, but you won’t get the Doppler effect for a gravitational field.
edited 6 hours ago
answered 6 hours ago
G. SmithG. Smith
8,98611427
8,98611427
add a comment |
add a comment |
jjmontes is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.
jjmontes is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.
jjmontes is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.
jjmontes is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.
Thanks for contributing an answer to Physics Stack Exchange!
- Please be sure to answer the question. Provide details and share your research!
But avoid …
- Asking for help, clarification, or responding to other answers.
- Making statements based on opinion; back them up with references or personal experience.
Use MathJax to format equations. MathJax reference.
To learn more, see our tips on writing great answers.
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function () {
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
});
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
StackExchange.ready(
function () {
StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2fphysics.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f466848%2fwhat-is-the-relationship-between-relativity-and-the-doppler-effect%23new-answer', 'question_page');
}
);
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function () {
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
});
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function () {
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
});
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function () {
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
});
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown